S1E9: Did Blues Legend Robert Johnson Make a Deal with the Devil? with Comedian Ian Harris

Jennifer Field: [00:00:04] Hey, what's up, everyone, welcome to episode number nine of the unofficial official story, I am Jennifer, the fearless investigator.

Koji Steven Sakai: [00:00:11] Yo yo yo, I'm koji, the so-called chief of the show.

Dwayne Perkins: [00:00:15] And last and probably least as well, I'm Dwayne the class clown.

Jennifer Field: [00:00:20] This is a podcast where we tell you the official story. We're going to take a look at the paranormal conspiracies, unexplained phenomena, cryitds and even true crime.

Koji Steven Sakai: [00:00:30] And in this episode, we're asking the question Did Blues legend Robert Johnson make a deal with the devil?

Dwayne Perkins: [00:00:36] And by the end, we'll tell you what really maybe happened.

Jennifer Field: [00:00:41] But first, we brought on a guest. Today we have comedian Ian Harris.

Koji Steven Sakai: [00:00:47] Ian Harris is a writer, director, comedian and editor at the age of Twenty Eight. Ian wrote, produced and directed his first feature film, It Burns When I Laugh and Eight Days on 16mm film for twenty seven thousand. I am super, super impressed. I need to see this film.

Ian Harris: [00:01:02] No, you don't. Nobody gets to see that film.

Koji Steven Sakai: [00:01:06] His films have played in festivals worldwide, receiving numerous awards and accolades. He has enjoyed much success as a stand up comedian, with many TV appearances, including Jimmy Kimmel Live, Comedy Central and two one hour TV special. He currently lives in Los Angeles with his wife and daughter, where he also owns an MMA gym called Bite Science MMA. How are you, Ian?

Ian Harris: [00:01:24] Good. Thanks for having me.

Koji Steven Sakai: [00:01:25] One thing I didn't mention in your bio was your podcast. Why don't you tell us a little bit about your podcast?

Ian Harris: [00:01:29] Oh yeah, which you guys were on this last week? Yes, it's called critical and thinking, which is oddly enough named after my first comedy special. It was also called Critical in thinking it's myself and comedian Ty Barnett. It's a it's now a political podcast. It wasn't meant to be a political podcast. It started out as like interviews, and it was supposed to be about critical thinking and things like that and a comedy podcast. And then everybody wants to see my act. All I talk about is I debunk things like, I'm a skeptic, so everything I do is like my. I've got three hours of material that's bigfoot ghosts, God, Christianity, Islam, whatever, whatever belief that we believe in on some sort of. I hate the word debunking, but that's what it is. So that was kind of what we started out doing. And then we write that we started right in the middle of Trumpism. So it was like every week we are like, OK, we can't ignore what he said today. And then we started getting followers because they were like, Oh, whoa, this is this is interesting. And then every week we're like, We're not going to talk about politics, but did you see what this guy did today? And then it got to where all we did was talk about politics, and now people tune in. Every now and then we do something. It's not about politics, and all we get is, how come you guys aren't talking about what happened today? We want to talk about what's going on on the border. We still try to keep it funny.

Koji Steven Sakai: [00:02:33] Why don't you tell me a little bit about how you became the Skeptic. 

Ian Harris: [00:02:36] Comedy was always like one of the things I wanted to do. It was it was like when I moved down to L.A. from the Bay Area in ninety two and I had written a screenplay. I was twenty one and I had a screenplay optioned and we moved down here with my my buddy and and we were going to write and direct and that was our thing and then always want to do standup. You do impressions and all this kind of stuff. And it was my goal to do standup and got into doing it immediately when I moved down here. And then in a few years, I was making a living at it, moved back to the Bay Area and then I was doing well, made this movie. It burns when I laugh. I moved back down here in two thousand and was kind of in and out like doing comedy, whatever, but making a living as a comic. And then I had a kid in two thousand five and I quit comedy completely. I had been up for MADtv three years in a row to producers didn't get it. I was supposed to meet Lorne Michaels and take over after Jimmy Fallon left on SNL. Like to be like the impression guy. And that didn't happen. So I just so I said, Screw it, I got a kid. I'm going to be on the road anymore. I'm going to dedicate my time to my gym and making films and go back to writing. So I quit for like six years and I've always been a skeptic in an atheist forever. My mom was a psychic. My dad was an atheist, so I saw it from both sides like the kind of irrational stuff and the and the wooey stuff. And then, you know, my dad being fairly rational was always a skeptic, but I didn't know that's what it was called until later on. And then in 2011, I turned 40 and my daughter was five or six, and she'd never seen me do comedy. And she didn't think of me as a comic because she'd never known me to do comedy. And all my friends would be like, Oh, you're comedian. She's like, What are you talking about? So I took her to an open mic at a coffee shop in Culver City, and I did a set and blew her away because it's all opened micers, right? So I did five minutes and just murdered this place, and my daughter was like, Oh, what is this? So I decided I'm going to get back on stage and do what I like. And since I didn't need to make a living doing it, I just got back on stage and just started riffing about shit that I thought was funny, like, Oh man ghosts, Oh, you people believe this crazy stuff? That's all I did, because I'm like, Who cares if nobody books me? Like, I don't need to make a living at it. I'm doing this for me. And the weirdest thing is within like a year, I had an hour of like my best written material ever. And I had this deal to do this thing on Sirius XM for the end of the world, the Mayan apocalypse. My friend offered to film it, and so we shot it and sold it. After 20 years in comedy, I did my first special after a year back. And ever since then, I've just been the most prolific, and the best I've done in general has been just because I love doing it.

Dwayne Perkins: [00:04:54] I mean, I don't want to jump too far ahead to this topic, but that that almost parallels Robert Johnson's journey like he went away for a year and they came back dope as hell.

Ian Harris: [00:05:03] Exactly.

Koji Steven Sakai: [00:05:05] Oh, so did you make a deal with the devil? Is the question.

Dwayne Perkins: [00:05:08] It was a bad deal.

Ian Harris: [00:05:11] Yeah, exactly. I'm going to deal with the devil's assistant. I'm like, Look, I'm going to go away for six years, and when I come back, I want to be slightly better than I was and maybe a little bit more money like we can do that. Do I need to get my soul, you know, but buy me lunch.

Jennifer Field: [00:05:27] All right, what do you guys think, should we get into this?

Koji Steven Sakai: [00:05:29] Yep, let's do it.

Dwayne Perkins: [00:05:30] Yep,

Jennifer Field: [00:05:30] Yep, yep. All right. So one of the things we all watched to give us deep background on the subject was a documentary on Netflix called Remastered Devil at the Crossroads. We'll put a link in our show notes, and we're going to give you guys some facts.

Koji Steven Sakai: [00:05:46] Robert Johnson was born on May 8th, 1911 in Hazelhurst, Mississippi. Little is known about his father, but he and his mother mainly lived in Robbinsville, Mississippi. Not a ton is known about Johnson, which is one of the reasons he's his legend has taken on a life of its own. We know that he first played the Jews harp and harmonica before the guitar. He's often considered one of the greatest blues musicians who has influenced music and musicians ever since. These include, but are not limited to, Bob Dylan, Eric Clapton, The Rolling Stones, LED Zeppelin, and more. There are about 40 original Johnson recordings left. Some of the most famous are Me and The Devil Blues, Hellhound on My Trail, Sweet Home Chicago. He died on August six nineteen thirty eight in Greenwood, Mississippi, from poison whiskey at a Juke joint. It has assumed a jealous lover, the owner of the Juke joint poisoned him after sleeping with that guy's wife.

Dwayne Perkins: [00:06:30] That's crazy. That's his story. But it's not the story we want to talk about today. The question is, did Robert Johnson make a deal with the devil? Johnson seems to always have played music, but he was never known to be to be great. But when he met Virginia Travis, who was very religious, he was willing to give that up, give up what her family called his devil music. People were really, really religious back then.

Koji Steven Sakai: [00:06:52] The Conservatives have not changed.

Dwayne Perkins: [00:06:55] Well, you know, it's crazy. My grandma raised me in that thing that persisted a long time like my grandma used to talk about like Sam Cooke, Ray Charles, even like Aretha Franklin doing secular music and how like that was a big deal when you switched over and did secular. It was like not acceptable. Even in the like. You skip ahead fifties, sixties. That was just like it was a big deal when you switched over.

Koji Steven Sakai: [00:07:21] How did your grandma feel about Tupac?

Dwayne Perkins: [00:07:24] I don't think she ever knew who Tupac was. I think she passed away before it happened. Well, it's weird because everything they the fears that they had seemed to have come to pass in a sense, but music was always going to reflect what was going on, you know, so I think it couldn't be stopped. But certainly like the church influence is really, really big on black people, which I think adds to the whole the legend thing. We could talk about that, too.

Ian Harris: [00:07:47] Also, don't you think the white people not wanting black people to be mainstream was probably a big, a big influence on that as well, don't you think?

Dwayne Perkins: [00:07:55] Oh, absolutely. 

Ian Harris: [00:07:56] It has to be like, Well, that's the devil's music. I mean, even when even when, like Elvis came out like white people didn't like him because he was doing colored moves. And I mean, that was kind of the thing. It's like, we can't like this guy because he's doing something that black people do like. That was kind of the thing. Well, it's

Koji Steven Sakai: [00:08:10] Weird. Like, you sexualize a people and then you sexualize them, and then you go ahead and vilify that sexualization that you put on them to begin with. You know what I mean? And I think the thing too, is that this is like not even a generation after slavery. So basically, you serve of a white god, and it's sort of built in that if you get anything good happen to you or anything that's out of the norm is evil. And as a slave, you probably think, What did I do to deserve this? So you kind of born with a bit of shame and a little bit of like just questioning what's going on. So I think everyone is downtrodden. So anything that goes against that, it's got to be evil. So anyway, Johnson in Virginia married, she quickly got pregnant so quickly. I wonder if she was already pregnant anyway. I'm not going to. I don't know about that, though. Two weeks before she was to give birth, she went to stay with her grandma. During these last two weeks, Johnson left their farm to play music for what must have felt to Johnson like the last time.

Koji Steven Sakai: [00:09:06] Do you think Virginia knew about that? He's going to take these last two weeks? Or do you think he just did it on his own?

Dwayne Perkins: [00:09:11] I feel like she knew, but her family wouldn't approve. So he was like, This is it. You know what I mean? It's like when people sell drugs and they're like, You know what? I'm giving this up. I've got one more packet of drugs to sell whatever drug it is. And then, boom, you get arrested, right? It's always the last score that messes you up.

Ian Harris: [00:09:29] When I'm bored, I drive Lyft and it always happens. The best ride is the always the last ride.

Dwayne Perkins: [00:09:34] That's exactly right. That's, you know, that's Murphy's Law in a sense. And I want everyone listening to understand this is a little bit of an aside. Murphy's Law is whatever can go wrong will go wrong. And my personal belief is Murphy's Law is strongest in Los Angeles. So before you come here, understand we got Murphy for your ass out here.

Ian Harris: [00:09:52] Ok, just let me also point out from the files of skepticism and old hack material.

Ian Harris: [00:10:00] Right, right.

Ian Harris: [00:10:00] It's always the last place you look because you stop looking after. You find it.

Dwayne Perkins: [00:10:05] Oh, there you go.

Ian Harris: [00:10:06] The keys, right where they go, Why are the keys always in the last place. You look because you stop looking after. You find your keys, right? Right. That's also part of it. It's like in jujitsu. They always go one more roll, and that's always when you break something. It's like, Well, yeah, there might have been another role after that, but you freakin broke something. 

Dwayne Perkins: [00:10:20] Interesting. Interesting. From now on, after I find my keys, I'm going to keep looking. How about that, Ian?

Ian Harris: [00:10:26] Yeah, exactly. In your face

Dwayne Perkins: [00:10:29] So, yeah, so Johnson goes to do this, this final gig and then just settle down and be a family man at the time, he was not even really a great guitarist. However, when Johnson visited Virginia, when he went to see his wife and kid, he found that both his wife and the baby had died during childbirth. Virginia's family blamed him and his devil's music for the tragedy. It's really sad, but without science, you have to blame something, right? This was when Johnson decided to dedicate his life to music. He played on the street corners and Juke joints. However, one problem he was considered a second rate musician. He wasn't good yet. Delta Blues legend Son House remembers that Johnson was a decent harmonica player but a terrible guitarist. He often had to chase Johnson away from the guitars because he and the other, more established musicians were worried that Johnson would break the strings. You know, he even said he'd come in here playing that noise. Go and get up. Go get that boy from the Jam Guitars libel. Anyway, that's my old black voice.

Koji Steven Sakai: [00:11:26] I can never do that accent.

Dwayne Perkins: [00:11:30] So that's when Johnson disappeared for a year. He just went underground, just in the cut.

Jennifer Field: [00:11:34] According to Legend, under the cover of Moonlight, Johnson went to the crossroads, got on his knees and made a deal with the devil, his soul for the ability to play the guitar like a god.

Koji Steven Sakai: [00:11:48] A lot of different places believe that they're the location of this. Yeah, the the actual crossroads that Johnson went to. So there's like a couple of places in Mississippi that claim to be the ones, and you could go visit them and you'd go to these different crossroads. I thought that was really fascinating. I actually wrote what I thought the crossroads was because I saw I found this place. I said they were. And then I found another place to said there and I was like, OK, no, neither of these places, and nobody really knows Where he went. 

Ian Harris: [00:12:10] And how many of them are like, Look, our roads cross. What more do you need?

Koji Steven Sakai: [00:12:13] That's exactly what it was

Ian Harris: [00:12:15] They cross In Mississippi.

Jennifer Field: [00:12:21] Johnson returned after being missing for about a year. Son House allegedly said to Johnson, Boy, now where are you going with that thing to noise? Somebody to death again?

Koji Steven Sakai: [00:12:32] Let's get Dwayne to do that.

Jennifer Field: [00:12:33] Yes, please

Dwayne Perkins: [00:12:34] Read the first line.

Jennifer Field: [00:12:35] Oh, yeah, OK, Son, House allegedly said to Johnson,

Dwayne Perkins: [00:12:40] Boy, Now where are you going with that thing? You're going to noise somebody to death again.

Jennifer Field: [00:12:43] Noise, noise, somebody. Noising people up. That was new for me. I love it. So Johnson began to play a seven string guitar that no one had ever seen before, and suddenly he was not just good at it, but he had become one of the greatest anyone had ever heard. Like, maybe ever, House allegedly said this about Johnson's new abilities. He sold his soul to the devil to play like that.

Dwayne Perkins: [00:13:05] Why couldn't God give it to him,

Ian Harris: [00:13:07] Right?

Dwayne Perkins: [00:13:07] Why couldn't he sell a soul in God?

Ian Harris: [00:13:09] Well, especially if we had a seven string. It's not like he had three six string guitars,

Dwayne Perkins: [00:13:13] Right? And seven is a seven is a godly number.

Ian Harris: [00:13:17] And you know, I mean, let's be honest, you can get pretty good at something in a year if you dedicate all your time to it and you don't have a wife around anymore. You're off in the middle of somewhere sitting in a field near crossroads.

Dwayne Perkins: [00:13:28] Absolutely. But that's the thing. It's where he played. I don't know if we talk about that, but it's where he played that added to the legend because he played in a in a graveyard.

Koji Steven Sakai: [00:13:36] Johnson isn't the only Blues legend with a mysterious backstory before Johnson. Tommy Johnson, who's not related to Robert Johnson, also allegedly made a deal with the devil. Well, most people believe probably happen isn't nearly as exciting. It's generally accepted that Johnson returned to Hazelhurst, Mississippi and under the tutelage of local guitar legend Zimmerman. They spent the year playing in the cemetery where got really good. By the way, these names are awesome.

Ian Harris: [00:13:56] There you go. That's why it's the devil Zimmerman. He's Jewish. A Jewish guy taught him how to play guitar. A Jewish guy taught a black guy how to play a guitar back in the twenties.

Koji Steven Sakai: [00:14:08] It was actually a black guy, a black guy. But it makes a stronger question was did Jewish people own slaves? I didn't think they were really heavy in that game, at least not, you know, maybe in the Egyptian era, then they were the slaves. I don't Know.

Ian Harris: [00:14:23] Maybe the guy just changed his name. Like, he's like, You know what? I'm just going to be called Zimmerman from now on. But I mean, look, if you're in Mississippi and you're a KKK guy and in the twenties or whatever, you hear that Zimmerman,

Dwayne Perkins: [00:14:34] Right, right?

Ian Harris: [00:14:35] Teaching the black guy, you're not really concerned with anything other than you heard Zimmerman.

Dwayne Perkins: [00:14:39] He changed his name, but then he didn't realize he like he didn't pick a better name, you know?

Ian Harris: [00:14:44] Exactly.

Dwayne Perkins: [00:14:46] He was like, No one's going to mess with me when I'm Zimmerman.

Ian Harris: [00:14:51] First name was schlumpy. James named Shlomo.

Dwayne Perkins: [00:14:52] Right, right. One last fact about Johnson that we found interesting he is one of the original members of the twenty seven club, a macabre or if you're in the UK macabre group of musicians who died at the age of twenty seven other than a Johnson. Other names include Jimi Hendrix, Janis Joplin, Jim Morrison, Kurt Cobain and Amy Winehouse. I looked up Sam Cooke and he died at thirty three same age as Jesus.

Ian Harris: [00:15:15] You know, you know the numbers for comedians. Thirty two. Three or four or five comics that died at thirty two.

Dwayne Perkins: [00:15:21] I made the cut. So the question that must be asked. Did they also make a deal with the devil? Two plus Seven is nine, nine percent, down is six,

Ian Harris: [00:15:30] Oh, oh, oh,

Jennifer Field: [00:15:33] Oh,

Ian Harris: [00:15:35] I think you just read off six names of people that died.

Jennifer Field: [00:15:37] When we come back, we're going to put our minds together and figure out what really may be happen. People always ask us how they can start a podcast, and one of the first things we tell people is that they should host their show on Buzzsprout like we do.

Dwayne Perkins: [00:15:53] Whether you're looking for a new marketing channel, have a message you want to share with the world, or just think it would be fun to have your own talk show. Podcasting is an easy, inexpensive and fun way to expand your reach online.

Koji Steven Sakai: [00:16:04] BuzzSprout is hands down the easiest and best way to launch, promote and track your podcast. Your show can be online and listed in all the major podcasts directories within minutes of finishing your recording.

Jennifer Field: [00:16:14] Following the link in the show, notes Lets BuzzSprout know that we sent you. You'll get a twenty dollars Amazon gift card if you sign up for a paid plan, and most importantly, you'll be helping support our show. Now that we've discussed the facts, let's workshop our ideas.

Dwayne Perkins: [00:16:30] This is so this story is intriguing. I watched this documentary maybe two years ago, actually, and I went on a deep dive. I was listening to his music. I think we must note that when we say he was a great guitarist, he almost created the current the blues genre as we know it, which also you speed it up. He basically created rock music, so we have to be super clear because he played the guitar as if two guitars were playing, and that's very common now. But that wasn't a thing back then. Like to play like a piano. You know, you got the chords and you got the notes. People didn't do that on the guitar. But he has really long fingers, so I really think he maybe just practiced a lot because he played the harmonica too. And he just was already had a musicians air. But the fact that it led to rock and roll and the fact that he played in the guitar is just bananas. So here's what I think really happened. Kind of let me just say one thing I don't like when movies do this, but I'm going to do it right now just to show you how much I don't like when movies do this. So if you have any issue when I say, then see Terminator, see Harry Potter, all those movies. So here's what I think happened. I think Bill and Ted were in search of the ultimate guitar, the ultimate song, and they were trying to really when Bill and Ted were traveling, even though we think of that movie as a fictional movie is based on some real guys. Ok. So, OK. So Bill and Ted traveled back in time and they had, you know, electric guitars. They had all this modern things and they they just appeared because they wanted to meet Robert Johnson. They appeared at this graveyard and he was still a bad guitarist. He was just in the graveyard being mediocre. And they told him how to really rock out. They told them how to how to just shred on a guitar. And then they went back and they went back to the future. And so then with that knowledge, he became great. So basically someone came back from the past Bill and Ted and taught Robert Johnson how to play guitar. That's my story.

Koji Steven Sakai: [00:18:22] This is very similar to Back to the Future.

Dwayne Perkins: [00:18:23] That's right. That's right. Yeah. He taught it was. Who was it? It was.

Ian Harris: [00:18:28] He went back and taught Chuck Berry.

Dwayne Perkins: [00:18:30] Chuck Berry. Yes, it yes. Chuck Berry.

Ian Harris: [00:18:31] It was Marvin Berry, Marvin Marvin.

Dwayne Perkins: [00:18:33] Right, right, right. Right. And one other thing Robert Johnson had no idea who these two guys were. So when people asked them, How did you get so good? He was like, I sold my soul to the devil. You would think that if you were in the graveyard and two guys come out of nowhere and they're like, you know, totally tubular. Yeah, he's like, Whatin The devil is this?

Ian Harris: [00:18:56] So what's good Zimmerman. Wait. Ooh, that's funny, Dwayne.

Jennifer Field: [00:19:02] That's that's good.

Dwayne Perkins: [00:19:03] So he told people he sold the soul to the devil, but it was just Bill and Ted.

Koji Steven Sakai: [00:19:07] My theory is that, yes, he did sell his soul to the devil, but it was a double cross. So the deal that Robert Johnson actually wanted was to bring back his wife and his child. And so he had to play the guitar for one year or until he died, basically. But the devil double crossed him because of what the devil had this long game. What they really wanted. He really wanted to do is destroy the world through the music of rap, country, hip hop, rock and roll, all of it jazz, because this is the beginning of the devil's music. It gets this quote worse as we get on, because. 

Dwayne Perkins: [00:19:39] So the devil had Lil Nas X written down somewhere on a piece of paper.

Koji Steven Sakai: [00:19:46] Yeah. Or what is the mumble rap? He mumble rap was like the thing that he knew was going to just destroy us. So that was a long game, and he used Robert Johnson as the beginning of that. So there was a deal. He did make a deal with the devil. It just wasn't the deal that we think he made, right? The deal he actually made was something a little bit more sweet. He wanted to bring back his child and his wife because I was like, that ruined his life, obviously.

Dwayne Perkins: [00:20:10] I like that. I like that a lot.

Jennifer Field: [00:20:11] Wow.

Jennifer Field: [00:20:12] Jennifer

Jennifer Field: [00:20:12] my theory is that he actually met with the Illuminati, so that's who the devil was. And the reason is because there's that like theory that Katy Perry and like Beyonce and people that have skyrocketing fame and skills and things like that are connected to the Illuminati. And then Jamie Foxx supposedly is part of the Illuminati.

Koji Steven Sakai: [00:20:35] Jay-z

Jennifer Field: [00:20:35] Jay-Z and I have a girlfriend that was like sleeping with Jamie Foxx at one point, and I don't know if she was lying. He actually said to her once, If you want to know how to get into the Illuminati, ask me, but I don't know. I swear. I believe It.

Ian Harris: [00:20:52] That's what he calls his bedroom.

Jennifer Field: [00:20:53] I don't know.

Ian Harris: [00:20:55] We call this the Illuminati.

Dwayne Perkins: [00:20:56] You sure he didn't say Elneny, and it's just sounded like Illuminati.

Koji Steven Sakai: [00:21:01] Or maybe he's quoting Tupac on Illuminati.

Jennifer Field: [00:21:06] There's something here. So that's what I think is that he he did make a deal, but it was with actual human beings that live here that are part of a secret society and the Illuminati.

Jennifer Field: [00:21:16] Why did they choose him?

Jennifer Field: [00:21:17] That's a good question.

Ian Harris: [00:21:18] It's a conspiracy quit asking questions.

Jennifer Field: [00:21:20] Right? Right? Why did they choose the Jay-Z and the. Jamie Foxx's, but they're all very talented.

Dwayne Perkins: [00:21:28] You have to be talented, so he he got to a level where they were like, You're talented enough. We're going to make your dreams come true.

Jennifer Field: [00:21:34] Yeah,

Dwayne Perkins: [00:21:35] Because he still has to get a record deal,

Ian Harris: [00:21:37] Right?

Dwayne Perkins: [00:21:37] You know, the reason why Mick Jagger picked up a guitar years later was because he heard Robert Johnson playing. You know what I mean? Not exactly that, but that he inspired people for years to come. So I like to. I like this.

Jennifer Field: [00:21:47] Yeah, they're behind big money stuff. So maybe they're behind the record deal that came out later and somebody saw his him playing at one of those Juke joints or something with the long fingers.

Koji Steven Sakai: [00:21:59] My favorite part Of this so far is the Jamie Foxx part

Jennifer Field: [00:22:02] Funny Story, right?

Koji Steven Sakai: [00:22:03] If I was ever really famous and I could just hook up with girls, I'm just going to tell them. Say that out of the blue.

Dwayne Perkins: [00:22:08] But the question becomes, then did he say that before he hooked up with her after? Because before it was, he was just trying to hook up with her after she put that thing on him? He didn't know what he was saying anymore. He was just

Jennifer Field: [00:22:19] I remember she said she was on his couch when he when he said it to her. So that must have been like right before. Right after. Yeah, so. 

Dwayne Perkins: [00:22:28] Right, right.

Jennifer Field: [00:22:28] But yeah, it's like kind of a legendary story because my other friends believe it her too. So who Knows?

Dwayne Perkins: [00:22:34] You know, I don't know your friend, but it's weird because we always go back to the D.B. Cooper thing. And what that proves is that people will make up stuff. So it's hard to say, Yeah, it's hard to say.

Ian Harris: [00:22:45] Well, mine actually kind of encompasses all year plus because it goes into what other like QAnon and crazy conspiracies have a little bit. But I have a couple of stories I have to really quick tell that give you the evidence for mine. So first off, I was an editor. Martin Scorsese came in and my boss told me, he said this morning, our Marty Scorsese and his editor are going to be in bay one or whatever. Nobody bug him. They're going to come in in the morning and they're going to do some editing. He's working on a documentary on the Blues. So I was there early in the morning working on my movie and guy came in. I showed him where to go, set him up, and I said, Hey, our Marty wasn't in yet. He started editing some stuff. I'm a big Robert Johnson fan. I had the two CD box of his stuff back when CDs were thing, and he was the guy who was editing and he pulled up his project and he was editing a section on Robert Johnson. I said, Oh, I'm big, Robert Johnson fan. He goes, Oh man, I love this section. He goes, I can't believe I left my music because I want to cut it, but I don't have any Robert Johnson loaded in. I said, Well, I've got the CDs in my car. He goes, Really? I said, yes, I ran down and I got a CD and we loaded some, some Robert Johnson music into it, into the avid so that he could do some editing. And Marty came in and I had to get out of the room. Marty's here and get the hell out of the room. So I left a few hours later, I came back. I said, Hey, where's where? I forgot who the guy's name, John, or whatever the name was. Oh, him and Marty left. So I said, Oh, do they leave my CD? We didn't see any CD and went back in. My CD was gone. Well, Martin Scorsese stole my Robert Johnson CD. Ok, now let's go back. A few years, there was a movie about Robert Johnson, who was based on Robert Johnson called Crossroads, who played Robert Johnson in that movie. Ralph Macchio.

Dwayne Perkins: [00:24:14] He played Robert Johnson.

Ian Harris: [00:24:15] It's inspired by That.

Dwayne Perkins: [00:24:16] Unless it was devil went down to Georgia, he would have been Johnny. But go ahead. Yeah.

Ian Harris: [00:24:21] It wasn't exactly about Robert Johnson was modern day. It was inspired by that. It's called crossroads. He learned from a black blues musician, sold it to the devil, but a white guy had. This is the whitewashing that we keep seeing. A white guy had to play the most famous black blues musician in history. Who do we get? Well, Robert Ralph Macchio is available as soon as he's done playing Harriet Tubman and Bruce Lee.

Dwayne Perkins: [00:24:44] Right, right.

Ian Harris: [00:24:44] Let's see if we can get him to play Robert Johnson, which makes me think, especially with this new information that I found out about this Zimmerman character. There's two contracts in the world that are stronger than a deal with the devil. A recording contract and a film contract. Try getting out on one of those two. All right. It's way harder. I think this Zimmerman guy was actually maybe he was in disguise, but I think he was actually a movie executive, and I think he made a deal with the movie executive. And the idea was to build this guy up to be so good that later on, they'd have a whole series of music. The Rolling Stones, he may and maybe even Dwayne. Maybe even the movie you talked about, Bill and Ted, maybe that Ralph Macchio also that they could build up white people based on this black guy's talent. And Zimmerman was actually again going back to the Jews run everything.

Dwayne Perkins: [00:25:30] Right, right?

Ian Harris: [00:25:31] Run the entertainment industry. So and maybe Zimmerman was in blackface. I don't know. I'm just saying that. 

Dwayne Perkins: [00:25:36] Right?

Ian Harris: [00:25:36] I think that it all comes back to the industry's racist trying to build up white people in the future so that white people can make a lot of money on the backs of black people.

Dwayne Perkins: [00:25:44] What I love about that is I've heard, like some people theorize, that rap music was made like some white guys sort of like pushed us to make rap music because not only is it sort of like what they rap about and capture the hearts and minds of young people and kind of like, maybe taint them, maybe poison them with just bad thoughts. But also, it's all about how do I keep selling the same catalog over and over again? Rap music, basically, it's like what we're sampling. So it's like, Well, who owns all the samples? It's the big record companies, the big media companies. So it's like we made money off of it already. Now we're making more and more money off it. So I really like this idea because. When I go to see a movie. It's like I paid you, I saw the movie. Let's end it there. Ok. I'm not going to get the twenty fifth edition DVD. I'm not going to go see Star Wars on Ice, OK?

Ian Harris: [00:26:38] Starring Sherman Hemsley,

Dwayne Perkins: [00:26:39] Right? I'm not going to sit and play. You got my ten bucks or 15 bucks. Let's end it there. But it's all about reselling. That's why there's a Spider-Man movie every two years. So what I like about this is that is that plants that first seed your theory Ian. It's like this guy is going to get big and we're going to eat off this forever.

Ian Harris: [00:27:00] For years.

Koji Steven Sakai: [00:27:00] That's very deep. That's a deep one. Guys, we're at that point where we decide which story is the correct story. We have to choose wisely, of course, because this is going to be the actual unofficial official story for the rest of eternity. Ian since you're our guess which theory do you want to go with?

Dwayne Perkins: [00:27:14] And it's OK to go with yours because we like you a lot. 

Koji Steven Sakai: [00:27:16] We like yours

Ian Harris: [00:27:19] The secular guy in me or the rational guy wants me to go, it's none of them want to learn to play guitar, and dude was good. And when I listen to him, I go, Yeah, he's good. But I don't think of him as like, you know, Stanley Jordan or like, I'm like, he was. He was good, but I'm like was just better than he was before. So,

Dwayne Perkins: [00:27:37] But he wasn't only good. He was transformative. No one did that before him. So even if he's not the greatest. It was a leap.

Ian Harris: [00:27:44] Yeah,

Dwayne Perkins: [00:27:44] It was a leap in progress. You know what I'm saying? A paradigm shift, if you will.

Ian Harris: [00:27:48] Yeah, yeah.

Koji Steven Sakai: [00:27:48] Sort of like Tupac.

Dwayne Perkins: [00:27:50] Right, right.

Ian Harris: [00:27:53] I'm going to have to defer because I'm like, I just I just want to give the guy credit for being a badass musician.

Dwayne Perkins: [00:27:58] Right, right.

Ian Harris: [00:27:59] Which wasn't one of the theories.

Dwayne Perkins: [00:28:00] Dwayne, what do you think? Wow. Do we want to go with that? He practiced. I mean, come on.

Koji Steven Sakai: [00:28:08] I kind of like that, though.

Dwayne Perkins: [00:28:10] I do. But I like even if it was tongue in cheek. I like Ian's theory that it was a record exec. Also, it incorporates Jennifer's theory because that record exec could have been in the Illuminati as well.

Jennifer Field: [00:28:22] Exactly.

Dwayne Perkins: [00:28:23] You know what I mean?

Jennifer Field: [00:28:24] And then it means that he did actually get That good,

Dwayne Perkins: [00:28:27] Right? Right, right? But I like Koji's in the sense that this guy is tortured. He's playing this great music, you know, can you just picture a guy and a guy in a Juke joint and he's just just wailing away and people are like, This is amazing, and he's just sad and he looks over. And Devil's just over in the corner looking at him like. And you never getting your wife and kids back. Oh, can you imagine being so sad while everyone else is so happy that you're playing. 

Koji Steven Sakai: [00:28:54] Like all the people that died at twenty seven, you know?

Dwayne Perkins: [00:28:56] Right?

Koji Steven Sakai: [00:28:57] They are just really sad.

Dwayne Perkins: [00:28:58] I like the record exact thing because he maybe he was in the Illuminati as well. You know,

Koji Steven Sakai: [00:29:02] We have to decide what you guys want.

Jennifer Field: [00:29:03] I like the record exact thing too.

Dwayne Perkins: [00:29:05] Well, because to the technology, because see before like if you go back five thousand years, people just had pictures, literally just drawings on the wall, and that's how you captured the hearts and minds. So this is like the beginning of recording. So they got in early. They're like, we need to get in early and really control this where it's going to go.

Ian Harris: [00:29:22] It's it's all encompassing here. It's really everybody's theories in one, right?

Dwayne Perkins: [00:29:26] Well, not the Bill and Ted

Ian Harris: [00:29:28] Well, except Bill and Ted is a movie. Oh,

Dwayne Perkins: [00:29:30] Right, right. That's true. That's true. Yes,

Ian Harris: [00:29:33] They knew. See, what happened, Dwyane, is they knew that you were going to have that theory.

Dwayne Perkins: [00:29:36] Right, right.

Ian Harris: [00:29:38] So they said, And then we'll make this movie and it'll make it even. Well, maybe Bill and Ted were real and they went back in history.

Jennifer Field: [00:29:44] This is it. We have done the work for you, unofficial official story listeners. We have dived deep and this is it. It's a Zimmerman exec that foresaw the gold mine of the recording industry. And that was coming. Yeah, blues, jazz, hip hop, country,

Dwayne Perkins: [00:30:03] Rock and roll, Absolutely.

Ian Harris: [00:30:03] And all the subsequent movies.

Jennifer Field: [00:30:06] And that is the official story. So let's take another break. Yes, and we're going to return and we'll make our own deals with the devil.

Dwayne Perkins: [00:30:14] Hypothetically.

Jennifer Field: [00:30:17] We can use your help. We aren't on a big network and we don't have big backers. We aren't getting paid. Wait, we're not getting paid. Yeah, that's right. That's why we need your help. So please consider supporting us on Patreon. Any amount helps us pay for the show. We are planning on having exclusive content for our supporters, so stay tuned. Ok. This month, we're going to come up with our own deals with the devil. Koji, tell us what deal you would make with the devil for your soul.

Koji Steven Sakai: [00:30:45] The first thing that came to mind Was something about making a movie with me and making a huge movie. But then I started really thinking about it. I want to make a deal for for my son. I really want to see my son make the major leagues. So my deal would be that my son would make the major leagues for my soul. The caveat is, I want to be alive. I want to be there.

Dwayne Perkins: [00:31:02] That's solid. Hypothetically, though, alive could mean like, you're a vegetable. You know what I mean?

Koji Steven Sakai: [00:31:08] Yeah,

Dwayne Perkins: [00:31:09] That's the thing. He's very tricky,

Koji Steven Sakai: [00:31:11] I need you in my corner when we're doing negotiations. Dwayne. 

Dwayne Perkins: [00:31:14] Right right?

Koji Steven Sakai: [00:31:16] I need to be conscious. Hey, Jennifer, what kind of deal would you make?

Jennifer Field: [00:31:22] I love it. Yeah, I also thought about a couple of different things, but I feel like the what I would ask for is I want to be a billionaire supposedly like more money, more problems. But I feel like I can just imagine my life. Like if I had millions and millions of dollars, I feel like everything would be comfortable. I would have a personal trainer, I would have a chef, I would have multiple nannies. I would get to take my friends on vacations like every month, and I would be able to fund our podcast. I would able to fund my movie. I would be able to like, have all the dermatological treatments that I need forever. I could just like not even work, and I could just be on vacation the rest of my life. So I don't know. I just want money.

Ian Harris: [00:32:02] You can make a deal with Jamie Foxx.

Dwayne Perkins: [00:32:07] Yeah. Also that that deal you can make, but it's just an old dude who's about to die, who's Rich

Koji Steven Sakai: [00:32:14] For the old dude. You have to do work, though you can't just, you know,

Jennifer Field: [00:32:16] Yeah,

Dwayne Perkins: [00:32:17] It's not much work.

Jennifer Field: [00:32:18] I've tried. I've been on two dates with two different billionaires that I will not name because they're known.

Dwayne Perkins: [00:32:23] That's outrageous.

Jennifer Field: [00:32:24] It was too much work, Dwayne,

Dwayne Perkins: [00:32:26] To Even be in the presence of billionaires. I've been in the presence of a billionaire, I think once in Dubai. It was very uncomfortable because, you know, he could he could just erase you.

Jennifer Field: [00:32:35] It's kind of mind boggling. And yeah, the two billionaires that I've went on dates with were very, very, very just, I don't know. I've just never met anyone like them. They just had very poor social skills and were extremely smart, and they had no sense of fashion or style.

Ian Harris: [00:32:54] He dated both Elon Musk and Bill Gates.

Dwayne Perkins: [00:32:59] Don't answer. Don't answer.

Ian Harris: [00:33:01] I want to know what that app is called.

Dwayne Perkins: [00:33:03] Right, right.

Jennifer Field: [00:33:06] It's actually my family friend. She's a matchmaker for the Silicon Valley millionaires and billionaires. That's how I met.

Dwayne Perkins: [00:33:12] Oh, that's outrageous. Yeah.

Jennifer Field: [00:33:15] And I went on base with some millionaires, too. But anyway, my point is is, yeah, I would rather make a deal with the devil than have to fake love with a billionaire.

Koji Steven Sakai: [00:33:23] Dwayne, what's yours?

Dwayne Perkins: [00:33:24] I don't want to like not do the exercise. Ok, once again. Hypothetically speaking, my idea would be that he would he or she, whoever the devil is with. 

Koji Steven Sakai: [00:33:34] The devil, could be they. Let's not be gender about this. 

Dwayne Perkins: [00:33:38] Right? Right? It could be they. Yeah, they would have to deal with be they snap a finger. Everyone in the whole world knows they exist. Everyone knows the devil exists. Everyone knows all of his tricks. And everyone loves whatever ultimate goodness is. And then I'm not around now if he's unwilling or they're unwilling to do that because they basically be putting themselves out of business, right? And everyone knows that for eternity, for eternity, everyone knows all your tricks and everyone sides with goodness. If you do that fine, I walk away. They make a statue out of me. You know what I mean? They name a day after me, whatever. If you're not going to do that, then I get like four long running sitcoms, a talk show and a movie deal

Ian Harris: [00:34:24] That is so funny because yours and mine are almost exactly the same at the exact same time the opposite. I'll make a deal with the devil that he comes out and admits to everybody that he doesn't exist.

Dwayne Perkins: [00:34:33] Oh, I see.

Ian Harris: [00:34:36] But actually my second one that I think I would like to, I would like to make a deal with the devil that I get to become the devil. Therefore, my deal and everybody else's are null and void.

Dwayne Perkins: [00:34:46] Oh, that's pretty cool. It is. It is similar. We have a similar.

Ian Harris: [00:34:50] Yeah, but actually caveat. A lot of people don't know this. I have to admit that unfortunately, you guys are all in trouble because I am the devil. At least that's what I'm told a lot after seeing my comedy.

Dwayne Perkins: [00:35:00] Right, right.

Ian Harris: [00:35:00] You all are screwed. Those deals are real. There's no hypothetical. Sorry, Dwayne.

Dwayne Perkins: [00:35:04] Right, right, right.

Ian Harris: [00:35:06] But enjoy your money, everybody.

Jennifer Field: [00:35:09] Yes, and thank you, Ian, for coming on with us, please tell us where people can follow you.

Ian Harris: [00:35:14] Well, my website, skeptic, comedian dot com or any social media, Facebook, Instagram, Twitter everything is at commediocre so it's comedy and mediocre and do a portmanteau com mediocre.

Koji Steven Sakai: [00:35:26] Tell us again about your podcast,

Ian Harris: [00:35:28] Critical and thinking podcast with Ted Barnett and Ian Harris. It's every Thursday at noon on Facebook, so you can go to Facebook.com Slash critical in thinking and like the page and you'll get a notification. But yeah, we go every every Thursday at Noon Live and then it's uploaded on all the podcast purveyors on Monday night, like iTunes and Stitcher and all that sort of stuff.

Dwayne Perkins: [00:35:44] Thank you. Thank you all so much for listening. There are a million podcasts out there, and we're honored that you've chosen ours to listen to.

Koji Steven Sakai: [00:35:51] Please check out our website, unofficial official story dot com for our show notes or to hear our past episodes.

Jennifer Field: [00:35:56] Be sure to come back next month for a Christmas episode. We're going to be answering the question Who killed JonBenet Ramsey?

Koji Steven Sakai: [00:36:03] It was the Parents. 

Dwayne Perkins: [00:36:04] Christmas Santa Claus. Yeah.

Koji Steven Sakai: [00:36:07] Santa Claus. All right, guys. Thank you,

Dwayne Perkins: [00:36:12] see you Guys. Thank you, everybody.

Ian Harris: [00:36:13] Thanks. Bye.